Follow-Up and Future...

We had our follow up with Dr H yesterday.  He talked about our FET transfer and he told us that the quality on the blasts that thawed were rated as "fair" but we were likely given the higher odds by the transferring doctor due to the embryos hatching.  He said something to the effect of he probably would have looked at both quality and hatching and maybe more weight should have been put on the "fair" rating.  Thanks.  That information would have been useful to us at the time not now morons.  Makes me so mad to know we should have been advised to transfer both instead of given such high odds based on one little bit of information and not the whole picture.

The rest of the appointment had it's positives and it's negatives.  The positive we came away with was that Dr H is willing to do some treatment for the autoimmune possibility (high dose steroids in the short term for 5-days and heparin or baby aspirin) and that insurance should cover the two tests he wants us to do (hysteroscopy and uterine biopsy).  The uterine biopsy is more for the purpose of raising odds of implantation than for finding an autoimmune cause.

However the negative we came away with is that the quality of embryos left isn't that stellar.  Dr H seemed pretty darn positive and then I reminded him that I didn't think we had any blastocysts left and so he reviewed the embryology report and some doubt crept in to even his positive outlook.  He talked about how they don't even freeze morulas on day 5 anymore (they wait til day six and if they haven't developed more they discard them).  In our understanding we have:  two EB3, two M2 cav, one M2- cav, one M3 cav and two M2 left.  He looked over the report and pointed out blasts and said he still thinks there is hope for one or two good viable chances at a live birth.  Again we were reminded that they didn't know what was frozen together.  Seriously that irks me and makes me so mad every time they say that.  How can you not know? or make a note?

Then he talked about doing one cycle and thawing everything and looking for the very best or doing two cycles and thawing one straw at a time.  We have two straws with 4 embryos in each remaining still.  When he talked about thawing both straws for one cycle I knew he didn't think our odds were that great.  He did end up recommending splitting it into two cycles if we could afford to because he felt it was a better chance still.  Then he started asking about the possibility of three out of four surviving a thaw and what we would do or how we would feel about transferring three.  Yep my "crappy odds" radar went off again.  I asked him how often they consider transferring three in situations with morulas and he said that each doctor considers it depending on circumstances and in this case it would likely be considered if we wanted to.  My hopes were down on the floor at this point.  I didn't cry.  I wanted to but I held it in.  Dr H tried to pick up the tone and hopes again by saying he was still very optimistic about this still working for us.  It helped but not very much.

He sent off a request to schedule the hysteroscopy in a few weeks.  He said we could do the scope and biopsy together but thought it might be beneficial with timing (in case there were something to correct found with the scope) to do them separately.  He mentally tried to figure out a possible timing for us...asking about my cycles and bum ovaries.  Once again I guess it pays to not have your ovaries running interference on things...they can schedule the scope without much timing and move forward pretty easily.  Then he said it might be tight to squeeze in a transfer before the clinic closed for the holidays.  I said that was fine and I didn't want to go through a cycle during the holidays or have another disappointment during that time anyway.  Wahoo for Miss Positive here huh?  So at any rate we are looking to have everything line up for a January cycle at this point.

Now we just have to consider the possibilities of one cycle vs two and whether we want to take the risk (if given and no matter how slim) of having twins or even triplets.  What a mess.  I don't really have much hope of this working anymore.  But I don't know how to not try still.  In some ways I just wish I had never crawled out of my cute babies and fun toddlers pleasant little cocoon to desire any more.

All or Nothing

That would seem to be the theme of today's appointment to discuss a frozen cycle.  Dr H did our transfer with our first cycle that resulted in Kendall and Seren.  Since our other doctor has retired since our last care we decided that we would like to proceed with Dr H.  Also we just like him more and find him very competent.  Anyway just a side note there.

The main note of course is that a) we can proceed whenever we like due to me being on birth control / hormone replacement and not needing Lupron (yeah for POF).  b) he doesn't advise transferring only one embryo during a frozen cycle.  c) of the 40% that get pregnant as a result of frozen embryo transfers 1/3 of those end up with a twin pregnancy.  So it would seem that this is really all or nothing.  To be honest the idea of it scared me at the appointment.  I was ready to balk and back out unless it was a single.  Yes we made it through twins once but the idea of doing it again with two already in tow was pretty darn terrifying to me.  Jeff seemed more to take it in stride.  Dr H asked "if you were to have twins again would it be the end of the world?" and I thought Jeff would be the first to say "yeah we're not going to do that" but he was just honest that it was hard but we could do it again if it came to that.

Now that Jeff and I have had a discussion about the chance it doesn't seem as daunting.  First of all, the chance of pregnancy with a frozen transfer is still around 40% (not stellar) and second of all if that 40% happens the chance of twins is only 33% or less.  So the combined likelihood (according to Jeff's calculation) is about a 13% chance of twins again.  I can live with that.  Will I be shaking in my boots if the result comes down the line that we might have two sets of twins in our home...yes, yes I probably will be.  But for now I feel good about giving it a chance still.

We are waiting to hear back on some matters from our hopeful donation couple and then we will begin moving forward with this little adventure.

Appointments...

I set up an appointment with UCRM for our viability ultrasound. We will officially get to see the kiddo(s) on May 24th. I am excited and it makes it seem more real but it still doesn't officially feel real. I am hoping for a good solid feeling and ultrasound on the 24th and wanting to tell our parents. Jeff is having fun having a secret from everyone but I am excited to share with family (prob only parents for now) and especially my parents who I feel have been openly pulling for this.

I also set up an appointment with my old ob/gyn Dr L. I am excited to be returning to her. I really liked her during my regular appointments and really found such appreciation and fondness for her and how she dealt with my POI diagnosis. I am excited to be able to go back and be pregnant and hopefully have her deliver the kiddo(s) someday too. We have that appointment on June 17th and I'll be 10 weeks at that point. Crazy!

I am still very nervous about telling anyone else and how to deal with things. I'm particularly worried about telling my good friend. I am not sure how I will go about it. I figure that I should tell her around the same time that we tell our parents so that she doesn't feel we were hiding it from them. But I'm so worried about offending her or hurting her. I even had a weird dream the other night that I didn't tell her until the babies were born (in my dream we had twins). I hope I can figure out a sensitive way to go about telling her. And as much as I thought about the day I'd be saying "I'm pregnant" on facebook (haha I know weird fantasy) I don't so much think I will make news of it there now. I have just been thinking about all of the friends I have on there that have infertility issues (or possible issues) and have lost babies and how I wasn't always happy to read news of others announcing their pregnancy. I think I will keep things private there...as in you will have to directly check my page or pictures to know about it.

Romance and Lining Checks...

You wouldn't think these two things go together but during our weekend they did. Things have been progressing well. I was recently going through a discount card from my old job that was expiring next month and printing off coupons. I came across a local B&B that was offering a discount. I thought of how I wanted to surprise Jeff with something romantic and fun to show appreciation for the support he's been with the DE IVF appointments and just all the infertility stuff leading up to this. He's been my sanity and rock. Anyway I decided on a whim to schedule a night stay. I contacted Nurse G regarding schedule and any "conflicts". She advised we were to start abstinence the week prior to retrieval but other than that to have fun (I really like her a lot more now that I see she is organized and caring).

Anyway this left me with one weekend available to schedule this. I reserved a room (Venice...bed and couch are set in a "gondola" and other fun amenities) and then on Sunday morning while Jeff played a game on his computer I secretly packed a bag for us and got his work clothes ready for the next morning. Luckily for me we had agreed to dinner in Salt Lake that night and then Jeff suggested a "pointless drive" to cross another item off my list (it's fun that he's picking up interest in the list).

It went so smooth and he didn't suspect a thing. I drove on the way back "home" and even more luck struck and there was an accident on I-15 with expected delays so I told Jeff I was getting off the exit to avoid this. He didn't suspect anything until I missed the turn to head north still. It was perfect. He was surprised and appreciative and it was fun to be somewhere fun and relax...I love surprising him and treating him (okay treating us) to a relaxing time since I know the next few weeks will be worrisome and stressful. It was much needed.

We went to the lining check appointment the next day (everything looked good) and my ovaries are still raisins which was a relief for once. We were told the donor is responding well and although they don't know for sure yet she appears to be doing as well as her first two cycles. We also met with Nurse G and were given instruction on how to do the PIO shots (which should start Thursday) and now we are armed and hopefully ready for the next step. I think we're both getting more nervous but we're also hopeful.

Two weeks...

Well we are now two weeks away from our expected 5-day transfer date. I was planning out a little surprise for Jeff (more on that later) and realized as I looked at my school, work and IVF calendars (haha yah they're fun to juggle) that it was coming down to the wire.

Anyway it is so close and I think we're both excited and nervous. We don't talk about it much. We talk about remembering our pills and future appointments but not the actual possibility. I for one am perfectly okay with this as the less I talk or worry about the positive or negative (literally) the less I feel freaked out. I am generally excited and have good feelings about it. But I also know that nothing is a sure thing. I am not excited to start PIO injections next week and Jeff is not either. He is so sweet and concerned about them and hurting me. I think it will be okay although it definitely won't be the most pleasant thing I've done. I'm going to submit a refill with Medco on my prescriptions as I'm worried about them delaying or being late and if things go well we'll need them immediately...so hopefully it's not a waste of money.

I used to think I would compare this to waiting for Christmas. And some days I do a little...it could be a really awesome gift at the end. But most days it's more of a feeling that I'm waiting to take a big test and maybe if I study hard enough and focus enough (eat well, take my pills and live healthy as possible) that maybe we'll pass the test at the end. I hope so.

I wonder if I'll feel normal...

Tomorrow I boost up my estrogen dose. I've told Jeff that I wonder how I will feel. It will be interesting to see if I feel any different. I haven't had "high" estrogen levels (that I know of) in over two years. I say that I know of because there have been times where my body does things that it shouldn't and it makes me wonder if it's working a little. I'll take extra estrogen for a week and then on the 19th we go for a lining check and instruction on PIO injections. I've told myself that with all the minor spotting I have had the last couple months that I may ask Dr. G to check on my ovaries just so I know they are still raisins so I won't worry about it. I've heard from other POF/POI girls that the extra estrogen is great and makes you feel good so I'm hoping it will.

Things definitely don't seem real still. We were thinking of things we could do or get for the donor and I came to the idea that a gift card for a massage would be cool. Then when we asked Nurse G about it we found out the donor is doing one more cycle after ours and then will be moving out of state. It was weird and kind of disappointing to hear. It makes me just really hope everything works as perfectly as possible with this. Like I don't really like the idea of using more then one donor cause I would like any possible kids to at least have the same DNA even if it's not mine. But Nurse G did say that they will still have contact information for the donor if any problems were to come up so who knows.

I also went and visited with my best bud from high school who recently had her second set of twins from IVF. She and her hubby have had a rough go of things and it is so nice to see her with her family and appreciation of it. She is the only person I know in person who seems to understand it at all (maybe not the donor part which is a whole different level) but everything else and beyond (they lost their baby boy from their first set of twins). It is such a blessing to have her to talk to and relate with. She is the only one in our personal lives outside of Jeff and I that knows the timing of things with this cycle. It was fun to see her and her boys and daughter. Although hearing stories of and watching her take care of the twins made me a little more leery of the idea of twins. Either way would be a blessing but after today I found myself just hoping for just one. I really just hope it works. I feel like I have shut myself off still at this point to the idea of either outcome, almost like I am just make believing we're doing things but that it's not real. I hope when reality hits that it's a nice place to be.

How do our minds look in there?

You know what makes a couple nervous during this process? It's not the physicals or blood tests or exams. It's meeting with the psychologist. The one you think will "probe deep into your mind" as Jeff said and bring something up you aren't prepared for or haven't thought of. But things were actually pretty nice. Dr. C was a nice woman and although Jeff and I were both nervous to meet with her we felt good about it. She talked with us about how we'd come to pursue donor egg invitro and the positives and negatives of the possibilities. We talked about our plans if it were to work (disclosure, risk of twins, etc) and our plans if it were to not (ways we cope with stress, getting a dog or going on a vacation). There was only one question about privacy and how to talk about privacy with child that we hadn't thought about. Everything was just smooth. Even Dr C commented on how easily things had gone and I think so much of that is because of the time we've had to think it through and prepare to be at this point.

It was interesting and although there were some questions that brought out emotion I didn't cry which surprised me. We had a couple laughs over our dating story (China Night being a "trashy Chinese restaurant") and what our reaction might be over twins. It was somewhat surreal to talk more candidly about the genetic side but at the same time realizing I wasn't emotional over the loss anymore (at least not then) felt really good. It was weird to realize that this might actually work. It has a good chance of working. Yeah!! It got me more excited and nervous too. I can't express how much we hope this works. Once again I'm glad we've had time on our side. Time to work through things and to put things in place the way that we hoped. Just so excited for April. It's coming up so quickly.

Just keep swimming...swimming...swimming

We got results back from my labs and Jeff's sperm hamster penetration test. So I wanted to throw up the Dory quote from Finding Nemo in honor of the sperm test. The penetration test is basically to find out if there will be any problem with Jeff's sperm penetrating the egg during the actual cycle. They take hamster egg(s) and mix them with his sperm to see if they can get the job done. And they did great. I'm sure they (the sperm) were a little disappointed it wasn't the real deal but we're grateful they gave their all just the same hehe So we can now count that down as a worry we don't have to worry about. Also my blood work and labs came back as a good to go too. We are go for launch. Our next appointment is with the psychologist for donor egg consult at the end of this month. I'm not too worried about that. We have been talking about this and working through this for the last two years. But I do think it will be good to talk to someone professionally and cover any concerns we might have.

Grant application

I suppose it doesn't matter now to put this on here. Jeff and I applied for a Family Building Grant from the Tinina Kade Foundation in August. We didn't tell anyone because we didn't want to have anyone waiting on it but us. We filled out a big application and got a referral letter from Dr. Gibson. The foundation is able to give up to $10,000 to the families awarded (last year they gave awards to 8 families). With our savings and finances in mind we requested $8,000. They were to notify those awarded by the end of October and the "winners" were supposed to fly to Washington D.C. for the formal awards on January 2nd. We received a confirmation of receipt email with 42 other applicants CC'd (yah not high marks on the privacy) and so we considered that perhaps that was all that had applied. We were more hopeful because of this.

We found out around October 17th that we were not being awarded anything. There were actually 130+ applicants. I guess we didn't really expect to get it but it still was a blow to our hopes. I wish there was a way to know why. I felt a little like the idea of donor egg stuff may have put us at a disadvantage. It is not really looked on with a positive light by most media I know of. It feels like we're never going to get anywhere on this. I know we will but right now it just stinks. With our budget right now we have no money that can go towards savings. I think the grant application and writing short essays on why we wanted it and thought we'd be good parents and such got us both more hopeful and thinking about the possibility more realistically. I know it did for me. Perhaps that's why it was an even worse let down. We do still have a good chunk of savings and despite money being tight we don't touch it which is a blessing. Hopefully soon we'll get where we need to be.

The donor specialist "appointment"

Jeff and I tried to go to an appointment with the egg donor specialist yesterday. Emphasis is on "tried". What a joke. We sat in the waiting room for 45 minutes before Jeff asked the receptionist what was going on. Then we waited another 10 minutes before the specialist called us in. Then she apologized and had the nerve to tell us she didn't know about the appointment and didn't have it written down. She proceded to try and ask me about history and the doctor we were working with and told me she didn't have my file available either...I guess I shouldn't have expected her to since she didn't have the appointment written down. But I think it just sunk in at that point and really set me off. I snapped at her and said "Are you kidding me? You don't have my file and you're not even prepared for this meeting? Forget it! We're leaving!" And I got up and stormed out of her office and out of the Clinic office with Jeff following behind me. I was livid and it just annoys me. You set an appointment expecting them to have information and to get answers...stuff you've been thinking about and looking forward to learning more about for a few weeks or more and then they totally drop the ball. I contacted Dr. G's office and asked them who to file a formal complaint with and we're going that route.

We even considered other clinics but the only other one in Utah doesn't have the best success rates or experience with donor egg and it costs more. The one's outside of Utah cost around $32k and that's not including travel expense, etc. So in the long run it looks like we are stuck with this clinic. I will definitely be checking on how involved this woman would be in a cycle though...like if she monitors or has anything to do with it past selecting a donor then I will be expressing my concerns left and right.